PC Expo = Windows Heaven 148
This is not the biggest show out there (Comdex owns that title!) but it's an influential one where hordes of ordinary computers users come to get an idea of what's new and hot. And what's hot here is Windows, Windows, Windows, and Palm. If there's a single overused buzzword here, it's "wireless." I think I've spotted that word, along with the phrase, "mobile Internet," at least a thousand times.
To give you an example of this show's scale just in case, like me, you mostly stick to Linux and Open Source expos, the Windows "partners" pavilion here is bigger than the entire Linux World Expo that was held here last February. It is a humbling experience to be a Linux user here, somewhat like the feeling FreeBSD advocates must have at Linux shows.
Even the two (prototype) Crusoe-powered IBM laptops on display are running Windows. In the display next to the two-story tropical-themed Crusoe extravaganza, Intel had screen after screen of Windows, despite all their recent make-nice moves toward Linux.
IBM has more Linux showing than most. A sign says, "You talk, Linux types" above the display for their new ViaVoice for Linux. And if you look closely at some of the "start" buttons in the lower left screen corners on some of IBM's thin-client products, you see Penguins instead of flying flags. Yes, that is Linux, quietly there, unadvertised, doing its job without any fanfare.
But forget Linux for a moment. Palm is the only presence here that even touches that of Windows. While the Palm "partners" pavilion is less than half the size of Microsoft's equivalent, the Palm one is constantly packed, so crowded that you have to edge sideways to get into it. Microsoft's display for Pocket PC, their renamed and updated WinCE, is deserted by comparison. Palms and Visors seem to be the wireless favorites, and they are almost everywhere here that Windows isn't.
There is a Linux pavilion, but it is sadly tucked into a lower-right corner of the less-than-main exhibit hall, and not as big, all told, as Dell Computer's single display. It is not uninhabited; LinuxMall, the pavilion sponsor, is doing steady business in assorted Linux goodies, and Isaiah, a Red Hat tech rep, said they gave out 400 Red Hat 6.2 CDs yesterday "in a couple of minutes, all to CEOs who said they have IT managers working for them." That was a wowser to Isiaiah, who was amazed "...that the people asking about Linux here are suits, not techies."
But there are a few signs of non-Windows life here, tucked away in corners, not always easily identifiable. For instance, I spotted a nice little "network appliance" gadget called a FoxBox made by NetWolves Corporation. I asked what OS it ran, and the booth person said, "FreeBSD."
I said, "It doesn't say that anywhere on the literature I see here."
He said, "Really? I suppose we ought to change that. Not many people have asked what operating system we run, and most of the ones who asked were relieved to find out it wasn't NT."
More on PC Expo, including John "maddog" Hall's keynote speech, tomorrow afternoon.
Double Standard (Score:2)
It seems as though instead of promoting healthy competition.. most people are only promoting Linux. Isnt this exactly what we are against (in terms of only promoting Windows).
Re:And this is an issue because?... (Score:2)
If you really like that shape keyboard, there are several companies (including Kensington and Keytronic I believe) that build similar keyboards. If I liked them, I'd buy one of those.
Re:And this is an issue because?... (Score:2)
PC vendors have basically zero innovation technically which is why they have to resort to cosmetic features to build product differentiation. Basically they all build the same boxes usually with prefab components as opposed to workstation and server vendors who build a lot larger percentage of their hardware specificaly for certain models. Most of the new ideas in the PC world are things that were pioneered by the workstations. That isn't surprising, as workstation and servers are high end, and have much larger R&D budgets than commodity markets such as desktop PCs.
- Workstation vendors stick to what works.
I should have been more clear about that. I meant that in terms of cosmetics. In general, workstation vendors (with the notable exception of SGI, which is known for wild color schemes and box shapes -- they did that before Apple, even) seem to turn out pretty industrial looking beige boxes or rackmount servers.
You should be in marketing.
Yikes. That is quite an uncalled for insult.
Re:slashdot going "down hill" (Score:1)
Your point is well taken that it is war only if the goal is victory. I was only pointing out that coexistence is rare, so victory or relegation to obscurity might be the only options. Then again, as I said above, if MS is broken up, it could well be a whole different ball game.
On a more off topic note, I'd like to thank you for the only reasonable reply made to my comment, its nice to see someone out there is still thinking.
FYI (Score:1)
binary-obsessed? (Score:1)
Browser use discrepencies (Score:2)
That was probably caused by people hitting the site at work, where they use a Windows box, but answering the question thinking about their home box, a Mac. Since you don't always get a choice about what OS to use at work, the poll answers probably accurately reflect what those people use at home. And what one chooses to use because one has a choice about it is, IMHO, a better reflection of mindshare than what one is forced to use.
-----
The real meaning of the GNU GPL:
Re:slashdot going "down hill" (Score:2)
See, no, we're not.
We're competing in a market space.
Hence the "rhetoric" warnings in my post.... Any competition has to be played within the boundaries of commonly-agreed rules. The less and laxer the rules, the more "competitive" the situation gets... follow that to its logical extreme and you get competition with no rules including the prohibition on physical violence, ie war. Yes, reductum ad absurdio... but that's the what the 'rhetoric' tags are for.
It's only our binary-obsessed Western mythos
War is an affliction on all cultures and in all times.
It's not a war. It's a competition, in the capitalist sense -- everyone wins different sized slices of the pie, but anyone who has a slice at all is a winner.
No, that's not true. Well, okay, it is true... but not in the context of traditional capitilism. Capitalism is based on the assumption of limited resources and unlimited demand (driven by necessity or greed). A finite pie, and no slice big enough. In this scenario, the only way to increase your pie share is at the expense of your competitor(s). The theory is that this should lead to a balance of players, each struggling against each other and providing the consumers with the benefits of lower prices/better products (Smith).... the reality is that situation is easily made unstable and results in monopoly capitalism (Reality). Anyway, that's straight Marx and lord knows hewrote enough of it so my repetition isn't going to help....
You can say that Microsoft is treating this as a war, and so we need to react in kind, but I maintain that setting "beat Microsoft" as the goal of any alternative project is the death knell for quality
No, beating Microsoft is just a side effect. The real objective is to get onto the nation's desktop. If Linux gets there and people decide, after making a fair decision, that they would rather have Winders... well, so be it. The fact of the matter is that for a variety of reasons that have little to do with technical merit, MS has a strangle hold on those desktops. They will not invite their competition into this hearland, so "we" must go there without their blessing. Nobody fights a war for the sake of killing the the opposition. They fight a war to gain territory or resources or political autonomy. The fact that the oppposing army (well, the civilians mostly...) get killed is a byproduct.
I would like to state one last time, that war is a bad thing and were it not for the fact that we tend to glorify it in the eyes of young boys of the middle class and drill it into their skulls daily, I would probably never consider it an appropriate metaphor for anything.
Give Out Linux CDs! (Score:1)
Re:And this is an issue because?... (Score:1)
Re:slashdot going "down hill" (Score:2)
I beg to differ. It _is_ Linux ready. I'm a Windowshead who recently saw the light, and today got SuSE 6.4 in the mail. Sure, installation took a hellish 3 hours of copying files, but it was quite painless in terms of intellect needed overall.
Some dicking around with sax for X config, and some more fiddling with YaST2 (fiddling = total 10 min), and I'm multitasking in X listening to my favorite mp3s while reading instructions on installing JBuilder Pro and porting my Win32 perlscripts.
All this for someone who's never touched an X terminal before, and screamed at the thought of killing processes with -9 using PID. IMHO, Linux has gotten to be extremely easy to use. I can't see how to make it easier!
Re:War, battle, conquest - is this the mindset? (Score:1)
I don't necessarily think that "chaos" is the right concept... We have a very different organizational structure: 1. It's based on de jure rather than de facto authority. As Kropotkin said "in the matter of shoes I deffer to the authority of a cobler".
2. It's decentralized. Sure there're a few high profile folks, but by and large it runs at the klatch level.
don't fight conventionally when you can win a different way.
That comes back to the positional vs. geurilla theory. MS has a massive positional advantage in the desktop arena that gives them a huge advantage. This advantage (ie, fud, saftey-in-numbers etc.) easily offsets technological weaknesses. They're the VHS of the world. We're the 3/4 inch (Apple gets to be Betamax). Honestly, VHS is not a great tech... but who the hell is going to buy a 3/4" deck if there are only 3 releases available to rent and you have to drive to another province to get them? I'm enough of an idealist that I believe that if Endusers were given an unfettered opportunity to make an informed choice they would choose Linux more than Winders. We can't get to that position by following the MS formula, though. We need to move into the niches as branch from there. The server niche goes nicely so far and embedded is shaping up, but neither of those are consumer niches. Apple has desktop publishing and soon amateur video. What do we have?
And, as the original poster said, remember that the pie is growing - and we keep getting larger fractions
Yes, the pie is growing but the fractions are changing much more slowly than the pie growth...
And my standard disclaimer... war sucks.
Re:slashdot going "down hill" (Score:1)
The desktop computer market, on the other hand, has been doubling in size every few years, and has been doing so for almost ten years. Every day there is a bewildering array of new applications and new markets opening up, and Microsoft can't cover all of them. It's really just a series of lucky historical accidents that allowed Microsoft to capture most of the growth of the last decade.
The key to staying alive or thriving is to capture your share of new growth plus a little more. Apple's been doing this just fine lately, and now they have a healthy 10% of a growing market. They don't need to 'beat' Microsoft, because there is plenty of money in what they've got.
As for Linux, the theory is that if it gets good enough, it can capture some of this new desktop growth. It's all potential on the client-side right now. On the other hand, the server market has been growing faster than even the client market, and Linux is mopping up there.
This "only one winner" crap on Slashdot is juvenilia at it's finest. AMD is doing great -- Intel must be going down (not true). Linux and Sun are selling -- Microsoft must be having a hard time (not true either). All boats are rising in this internet tidal wave.
Re:I was at PC Expo today (Score:2)
As you stated the Linux pavilion was dismal. Believe it or not, last year since Linux was "risky" it was off downstairs --however, they had a big Corel stand (with free distro's) and RedHat of course was there. Far more interesting displays in the previous years.
For the fun of it, I'll mention what I thought of some vendors..
The AMD folk were all cool. A woman took the time to just show me the PGA athlons and mentioned how the duron would follow the same path, they even had a big burly guy working there that didnt fit the corporate "mold." The SGI people on the other hand were holding electrical probes to zap us if we went anywhere near their displays. Intel had a decent sized section but their presentation was even less informative than the previous year (though the people were better). The IBM people had the "sweaty car salesman look" as usual. Transmeta had a decent presentation on the crusoe obviously.. heh, and they gave away little pretend crusoe chips (after they ran out of "fans." (Fans were handed out with them saying "The only fan you'll ever need"). Overall, I'd say the PCExpo better start getting more cutting edge and less of the buzz word ambush like it has become.
Re:Hot Grits? (Score:3)
We (as in Slashdot, not you and I) have a regular troll (as in moderatly funny offtopic poster, not the mythical bridge-loving hairy kind) who seems to have made a running joke (as in from the Laugh-it-was funny-the-first-five-times-but-not-now Dept.) out of the act of pouring grits (as in a hot breakfast food enjoyed by ninja and those south of the Mason-Dixon Line, not what you find on sandpaper) down his or her pants. (as in the cloth covering you are hopefully wearing over your legs, not what a dog does in summer.)
He (the troll) is affectionatly known as "The Hot Grits Guy" (for obvious reasons, the most notable is that we don't rightly know his name). If you would like, you can scroll (use that bar on the right border of your browser) down to the end of the page (as in this article) and see some of his (as in, The Hot Grits Guy) work. (as in, his posts.) While you're down there, look for "The Saga of the Troll War", "Star (as in hot young actress) Wars, as well as Mr. Patrick Bateman's soulful "Imagine a Beowulf cluster of these!".
Re:CNBC Coverage (Score:1)
I love the kludges that people come up with to make a product do something it was never designed to do.
gawd, i love the smell of napalm in morning... ...smells like, victory!
oh yes (Score:3)
Slashdot headlines for next week...
Signal 11 makes worthless comment in worthless article, receives another +5 funny by worthless moderation.
NightHawk
Tyranny =Gov. choosing how much power to give the People.
What would running Linux show? (Score:1)
Windows on the other hand, is much pickier about who it runs with.
At this point in time, you would have to go hugely out of your way to design a machine that won't run Linux, and that would just be a thrown glove to the development crowd.
slashdot going "down hill" (Score:5)
For the last year the linux-centric media (here included) have been blaring that linux is "ready for the desktop", "set for primetime" and "friendly enough for my dad". If you get most of yer daily quotient of geek news from said media, you might actually get into a head space where you believe that linux's domination of Joe Q. Enduser's desktop is imminent. If anything, this article is a much-needed reminder that this is notthe case.
Start rhetoric: We are fighting a war. A war against a very large, very well-funded enemy. This enemy owns most of the land and major resources. We are iquana-eating geurillas living in the hills, hiding under bushes every time a helicoper flies over. In any geurilla war, there comes a time when the geurillas have to make a decision to stop playing hit-and-run and move into the arena of positional warfare. The biggest threat to success is making that decision too soon. A few victories can swell heads fast and lead to brash maneouvers later on.End rhetoric.
Here's the facts: linux owns a tiny percentage of the boxes out there and then even then only in narrow markets. The Fatherland of the desktop is still far, far behind the lines. If we tout linux as desktop-ready before it can actually compete we run the risk of further entrenching the notion that our beloved OS is a toy for propellerheads and nothing more.
It's good to be reminded that the recipie-catalogers and porn-surfers of the world are winders zombies. It helps prevent hubris. We may celebrate the fact that the media has dropped "upstart" as a mandatory adjective when they talk about linux, but remember that Apple lost "beleaguered" two years ago and they still can't put a serious dent in redmond. We're still in the hills, Winders is still down on the convention floor... we need to remeber that if we are to have a hope of winning.
For the record, I think war is absolutely the stupidist thing humans have ever thought up. I chose the analogy only to cover up my complete lack of understanding about sports :)
Geez people make me wonder (Score:1)
Now we have 'So what if the thing was MS-centric, we don't really care...this isnt news! Slashdot SUCKS!'... Geez people, if you can stop bashing
Simon
Re:Mouse (Score:2)
All that aside, that has nothing to do with the fact that I just plain don't like the design of their mice or keyboards. I never said they were poorly constructed, just that I didn't like them and why.
One beef that I have heard others in my office have with the Intellimouse is that they seem to occasionally freak out when the person switches their Belkin OmniPort switchbox and they have to switch back and forth again to get the mouse to come back to life. I've never had any problems like that with the Logitech MouseMan I am using.
I also think Microsoft's hardware products are rather overpriced. I don't think they'd be able to get the prices they do for what they are selling if it weren't for the blind devotion of the unwashed masses to their overadvertised brand name.
hmm. (Score:1)
Re:And this is an issue because?... (Score:2)
CNBC Coverage (Score:4)
Marketing Dollars (Score:1)
Re:And this is an issue because?... (Score:1)
Regards, Ulli
Overclockers.com article (Score:1)
I was bemused by the couple Linux areas. No freebies there, best I could tell. Everything was for sale, at quite capitalist prices. Get a 10-inch penguin: $20. T-shirts, sweatshirts, $20-25. Guess you have to make your money somewhere.
They had someone in a penguin suit meandering and falling down, which is what I thought Linux wasn't supposed to do.:)
So? (Score:1)
Re:Microsoft's endless pockets (Score:1)
This dominance of a show was just one example of what we can expect. However, in the future we could have 2,3 or 4 "Microsofts" there.
Bill is still the worlds richest man. Bill will continue to be the worlds richest man - possibly it will make him richer.
Mong.
* Paul Madley
Windows is still the dominant OS out there (Score:1)
Thats because Windows is still the Biggest Fish and Linux would take an eternity to get there.
Just my 2cents
When in doubt - RTFM
Re:CNBC Coverage (Score:2)
Re:Oh no. (Score:1)
Linux at previously windows expos (Score:1)
last week when I went I had my LinuxFund t-shirt on and a tux the penguin in my pocket..To my surprise just about everyone there knew what Linux was AND many were showing off linux in software, hardware, training etc... I even got several Job offers.. (WOW!) last time I went to this show it was windows only.... Microsoft was even there two years ago.. but now things are changing. several people who didn't know much about linux stated that they NEEDED to learn it..
Re:Really?! (Score:1)
Re:slashdot going "down hill" (Score:1)
Closed source's weakness is that management can kill a project because Sales/Marketing can't see a way to make money, even though devlopers think the project is a Really Neat Thing. Emacs survived despite management opposition, as did Gnutilla (although not as Gnutilla itself), and that is because once a program is freed to open source, if it has any merit, it survives nicely. You don't even need to spell it right.
Open Source needs developers, that it accretes users as well is useful and nice, but it's not all that necessary to the revenue stream .
For volunteers to keep hacking away, flaming each others' mad implementations, and producing an environment where the bugs are found and stomped fast, they need feedback, not necessarily revenue.
Closed source's development model is dependant on marketing rather than developer mindshare, so that bugs may be ignored until the Sales/Marketing people scream bloody murder because somebody says "ILOVEYOU' and their sales reps are getting lynched for trying to sell the product that just failed to protect user data.
It's not about the market, it's about mindshare. While open source is getting more market, and this is aa Good Thing, developers can tinker with it, even lacking a market, because it's fun (and for some, necessary) to have a stable, secure system.
hey, screw cakewalk/cubase/windoze (Score:1)
It's a Windows world (Score:1)
The future's bright, the future's Linux.
Re:Say what? (Score:2)
Clearly you're not going to win your battle for Linux by calling him a dope and trying to undermine his credibility with your research. Instead of being a snob and contributing to the universally bad image of Linux users, listen to what he says. Ask him real, non-hostile questions about his decision to use NT until either you are convinced that he has a good idea or he has discovered the faults in his logic.
oh dear (Score:1)
C'mon wake up people (and smell the coffee)
-------------------------------------------------
Isn't Cebit bigger than Comdex? (Score:1)
Now moderate down as flamebait.
J.
Re:I'm afraid you're missing the point. (Score:1)
//rdj
Call for the slashdot olympics (Score:1)
The dread donkpunch and I are planning a 'slashdot olympics' and we neeed you. Let me know if you're willing to put your reputation as ultimate poster on the line in the quest to bring home the gold.
--Shoeboy
Say what? (Score:5)
Did Roblimo just look at the entryway and go home?
Followed by:
What brand of crack was he smoking?
As I walked in, of course I saw more wireless tech. Last year, it was Microsoft, Compaq and Bell Atlantic Mobile close to the front. This year, it was Microsoft, Gateway, and GoAmerica (at Verizon's booth, according to the handouts)
Once you bothered to look around, though, there was the oft-proclaimed Transmeta booth, with Mobile Linux-powered WebPads everywhere, and Linus (yes, *that* Linus) was even around, if only for the one day.
Redhat had a small booth again, which leads me to believe that they just don't want to shell out the bucks for the extra space. But the Linux presence was at least double to triple its level from last year.
Of course, why would Windows have to much space? Hrm... maybe it's just a result of them having more money to throw at buying floor space. Remember, you can say all you want against Microsoft products, but you cannot deny their status as a marketing juggernaut. All you had to do to escape MicrosoftLand was walk about 50 to 100 feet out. ISPs were there in force, and yes, there were a lot of hardware demonstrations, totally isolated from Windows, PalmOS, or any UNIX variant.
Maybe to someone who seems to attend Open Source/Linux trade shows, it might seem that it's all Windows, but that just proves the narrowmindedness that has pervaded the minds of the Open Source Community. Sorry to tell you guys, but we're not there yet. Windows still sells, and while the Windows GUI might be unintuitive, and the OS might be unstable (or so
It all goes back to what one of the Toshiba droids said yesterday at the Expo:
"We're not going to support this 'Crusoe' chip you're asking about, because it's not Intel, and people buy the name."
I may have slightly misquoted that, mind you, but it's the same deal. If your product doesn't rely on an Intel chip and run a Microsoft OS, Marketing will lead you to believe that it won't sell. If that fails, then you're not going to represent the product, they'll just send marketing. Mind you, that one Toshiba man (and many IBM people) had no idea what Transmeta was!
As for the wireless, you can't be surprised by that. The recent release of Bluetooth, and the prevalence of 802.11 is fueling that, and can you honestly say that you don't like the idea that you can disconnect that one extra cable when you want to? Do you really want that laptop that you were assigned to need a dongle, another network cable, and so on, when you can just plug it in once the batteries are low, and that's it? The idea is that we're trying to make portable technology more convenient. That is the future of computing, just like shrinking computers, boosting throughput, and the internet were all the proposed future at some point. Now that those goals have been realized, of course the industry is going to change their (admittedly narrow) focus onto something else.
Raptor
Re:Sigh. Stupid consumer, overzealous CEOs.... (Score:2)
Of course you're right, but people have always been fascinated by the new, fast, sexy stuff. That's not going to change.
<OT> What's starting to really piss me off are the genetics stories from the past 12 months. The headlines are like *big type* Gemone Project decodes entire genome, all disease and human suffering will end *little type* as soon as we annotate it and begin to understand what the hell is in there...maybe. It reminds me of *big type* You have just won ten million dollars *little type* assuming you have the winning numbers. I'm proposing a Slashdot ban on genetics milestone stories, is anyone with me? </OT>
-B
Microsoft has the money... (Score:1)
Also, as I see it...and I am not just saying this because of my employer...but a big thumbs up for the companies who are selling both products and took the time to teach their representatives enough to run and talk Linux. Some of those reps haven't a clue and would be confused by the pause at a LILO prompt and shut the machine down.
More amazing still... (Score:3)
1. Is it an enterprise-class solution?
2. Can I get it from an application service provider?
3. Is it web-enabled?
4. What sort of wireless messaging capabilities does it provide?
-cwk.
Intel names new processor (Score:1)
Re:slashdot going "down hill" (Score:1)
While I agree Windows has some ways to go before it's a really REALLY good OS, it is NOT *THAT* bad. Granted, Windows 9x lacks a lot in the way of security etc (and has a mindnumbingly annoying need for being re-installed every few months, but that's because i fuck with it a lot), but what I've seen of Win2K (yes, i've been running it for the last month and a half) gives me a lot better picture overall (for the USER, not a geek who likes to pore through 412349324 lines of code a day just to make stuff work). I haven't seen any of the 64000 "bugs" (32000 bugs and 32000 things that users wants solved another way IIRC)... maybe that's because it's not all that easy to FIND those bugs (i.e. they're in obscure places etc). Altho I have found the Driver Upgrade Wizard to be exceptionally slow when *I* want to find an updated driver (it chugs the HD 15 seconds or so... that HAS to be fixed, it's way too annoying, even tho I update a driver like once every month or so).
I want a web server? It's easy to set up, and even easier to configure. Serves the main thing any NORMAL user might want to use a web server for, maybe even a small-time website (no idea how well it scales, so no comment on that). Same with FTP servers. In linux however, you have to fetch that from somewhere else, or *gasp, shock, horror!* you have to TYPE STUFF to get it installed. No matter what the average linux user says, the normal computer user ISN'T ready for that, and they never will be. How many NORMAL (not geeks or freaks, NORMAL) people do YOU know that would want to go under the hood of a car just to get it started, when another car has the ignition inside the car, ready to be turned?
Linux has its place among servers and as power-user desktop OS's, and that is pretty much how I foresee it for the next 2-4 years. Going around saying "Windows must die! GO LINUX!" is really rather pathetic, seeing as the idea behind linux... is diversity.
You want a war? fine. go to bosnia or something. Desktop OS's isn't a place to define as a war-zone. It's a place where people can pick and choose amongst several contenders as their needs etc demand, not a place for other people's needs to be advocated as the One True Way of Doing Things (tm).
Re:slashdot going "down hill" (Score:1)
I'll be the first to agree, however, that once it's installed, the picture becomes less blurred, but linux is still more demanding than MS's OSs.
I can mention one reason I'll recommend Win2K over linux for a normal user (I'll refrain from mentioning Win9x, since they aren't even competing with linux with regards to stability)... The help system. In linux you either have to download some help system (haven't found one yet, but I haven't looked either, the man system works fine for me), or (shock horror) type stuff to figure out stuff... let's not mention you have to know WHAT to look for in the first place. Win2K's help system is a lot better in that regard, and no matter what you (or anyone else says), that, combined with the fact Win2K IS a lot better than the other MS OSs I've tried... just convinces me right then and there.
PS: I still use linux, but on a more professional level (servers etc). I do run one computer with linux as its main os for my own use, but that isn't my main computer.
Re:Intel names new processor (Score:1)
Re:Welcome to the really real world. (Score:1)
Um, your experience is not typical, and your argument shows a lack of understanding. Getting kicked before you said anything is more likly due to an over zealous idiot with ops, or a channel takeover, or a bad domain-mask for a ban that someone had set. Yes, sometimes Linux channels are full of big headed zealots, but there are plenty of other channels to go get help.
On an entirely diferent note, i suggest you don't use IRC because it's too damn addictive. On a computer at 4am and not coding? That'll be IRC then
Proprietary Standard (Score:1)
Hope this didn't post twice...
Re:Say what? (Score:1)
The elitist bunch of users, however, is the exact kind of people linux REALLY doesn't need too many of. People need to learn to sit back and see not just what CAN be done, but what can be done most efficiently. If a person knows NT, why FORCE him into using linux? On the flipside, if a guy knows linux, why force HIM into using NT? It's all a matter of "everything has its place", which sadly a lot of zealots (in both worlds) utterly fail to see.
Guess what (Score:2)
Re:CNBC Coverage (Score:1)
Jeez.
Re:Funny MSNBC coverage (Score:1)
-Agelmar
Oop... nmind his post was at 0 (Score:1)
Sorry
-Agelmar
Re:CNBC Coverage (Score:1)
And I believe it's a good thing to have console access. Just today I noticed one computer had lost track of network. And why would I ever allow network connections to my firewall? Through, yes, but to the box? Console access is good for broken hardware cases, too. And lots more.
Re:CNBC Coverage (Score:1)
Linux Speaker (Score:1)
At least, they have Jon "Maddog" Hall as one of their speakers to talk about Linux...
Mario.
Funny MSNBC coverage (Score:4)
Enhancement for Slashdot user setup: (Score:1)
It can be a pain in the *ss to find out that
from 10 contributions with thresholds > 1
4 are such 'funny' ones.
But eventually I seem to lack some humor because
often I would describe such high scoring 'funny'
postings with the simple word: 'stupid'.
Their rating sometimes tells more about the
intelligence of the rating person than the rated
posting itself. IMHO.
And this is no fun.
Re:slashdot going "down hill" (Score:1)
KV switches (Score:1)
Re:CNBC Coverage (Score:2)
But the single user *nix or purpose built boxes died, replaced by multi user *nix, Novell and Cisco that could be manipulated over the network. They grew up. Windows was the only OS that didn't.
Re:Sigh. Stupid consumer, overzealous CEOs.... (Score:1)
OK, we've got "e-mostly everything" covered so now we're getting "m-the first things", like m-commerce (being able to buy using mobile whatever, usually cell phone), m-business (being able to create an order using mobile whatever while at customer's place), and so on. I'm surprised they haven't invented m-communications (being able to talk to that cell phone).
Yes, I do believe in e-economy (and m-economy) for what's it worth. But not in the hype-form. It's much more than the hype shows, and most of it will happen in the background.
My, how times have changed. (Score:2)
Re:And this is an issue because?... (Score:2)
Yuck. They tried to give those items to me here at work, however, I rejected them in favor of a more normal (non-warped) keyboard and a true 3-button Logitech MouseMan which Iscavenged out of the parts bin.
I don't like the shape or feel of Microsoft's mice, let alone I want a true 3-button mouse not the goofy roller clicker thing in the middle. I would never be able to adapt to the warped keyboards, aside from the fact that they take up way too much desk space.
Besides that, I don't think I've ever visited Expedia...
War, battle, conquest - is this the mindset? (Score:2)
Except:
In a war, you win by imposing chaos on your enemy and allowing your units to function. Since we are organized chaos, it's hard for them to impose further chaos on us, and easy for us to impose chaos upon them.
Some simple things to keep in mind:
Don't let the enemy impose the rules. Impose your own rules, define your own battlefield, determine your own objectives. Maybe we don't want to do GUI stuff for p0rn users. Maybe we don't want to seemless integration in one box. Maybe we don't want to make security easy so we're easy to hack.
Don't worry about the bucks. Let the corporate greedheads worry about the bucks. You want to change the world. Money is just a method to measure how much control one has of resources. MSFT has lots of that. But if we undermine control and reestablish the valuation system, we devalue his currency. Just like the British Secret Service counterfeited money to win the Falklands War - don't fight conventionally when you can win a different way.
Ain't nothing wrong with fighting on the Server Front. Who cares if it doesn't have fancy graphics - what do we use those for, anyway? Slide show presentations? Now, if you can crank out MP3 files and PNG faster, that I might care about.
And, as the original poster said, remember that the pie is growing - and we keep getting larger fractions. This is good, and MSFT knows it. They may talk about selling 3 million W2K licenses, but how many of those had some guy install Linux on top of it? A heck of a lot, that's for sure.
the Crusoe webpad was running linux (Score:1)
Re:Hot Grits? (Score:2)
oh yeah, and if you ever compliment a guy on his pants you are going to get some seriously weird looks.
some things are funny because they are repeated, try Robert Rankin.
bye bye karma :P
Re:Sadly... (Score:1)
Re:And this is an issue because?... (Score:1)
Right now, however, i own a Microsoft Intellimouse Explorer, and quite frankly, I'm in love with the last 2 buttons. I wince every time i have to use a button without those buttons, let alone without that mousewheel.
Another thing, the IME fits my hand quite nicely, contrary to the pilot+, which was so small, i constantly got a cramp whenever i played a game for an extended amount of time (5+ hour gaming sessions have been known to occur).
As for the keyboard, however, I recently went back to using an old clicky 286 keyboard, because i broke the (non-windows keyed) keyboard i got with my first computer (p90, 4 years ago). I wasn't happy with that, since i'd worn down the keys to a nice, shiny state... i'd even worn away 95% of the text on the "m" key... And I refuse to get a natural keyboard simply because it's different from what i'm used to. Heck, i've refrained from using this clicky keyboard up until now simply because the ' key is in a different place from what i'm used to (4 years of DEEPLY ingrown typing habits are hard to change).
Re:Welcome to the really real world. (Score:2)
Did you see a message something like this?
Create a normal user and log in through that account. Do not IRC as root. Banned for your own protection.
:^)
"Free your mind and your ass will follow"
AMD Roach Clips (Score:2)
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I'm afraid you're missing the point. (Score:2)
Re:And this is an issue because?... (Score:2)
logitech has a comfortable, minimally warped one; the mouseman+ I believe it is named. its the same one bought in bulk and branded by hewlitt packard
try it before you knock it
Re:slashdot going "down hill" (Score:5)
See, no, we're not.
We're competing in a market space.
It's only our binary-obsessed Western mythos that has to cast everything in terms of good/evil, us/them, black/white, and winners/losers.
In a market space, there's plenty of room to be very successful in second or third or tenth place. This isn't a war, it's not a sport, it's not a race.
And that's the way it should be. As soon as you start framing your thoughts in terms of beating the other guy, you have stopped framing your thoughts in terms of being the best you can; being 'on top' is good enough, even if your product is shoddy.
You can say that Microsoft is treating this as a war, and so we need to react in kind, but I maintain that setting "beat Microsoft" as the goal of any alternative project is the death knell for quality in that project. Being better than Microsoft is not hard. Continuing to improve for its OWN sake is the hard part.
It's not a war. It's a competition, in the capitalist sense -- everyone wins different sized slices of the pie, but anyone who has a slice at all is a winner.
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Re:Say what? (Score:2)
Well, basically, Tampa (or at least our office) is in a timewarp, I've heard my new boss refer to Linux as "underground crap" and "freeware," as well as a constant din of saying "Linux sucks" anytime any problem arises. (The application we were left with was a Big Ball of Mud [laputan.org], but this has nothing to do with Linux. The new guy finds it convenient for pushing his agenda, though, to blame every single problem on Linux and say, "If this were NT, we'd be done already.")
Well, that being said, every Linux box we've gotten here in the Tampa office he wants to "blast" (his term for re-format) and make into an NT/2000/Tinkertoy-whatever box. Even if they have valuable information on them that will be lost... and I haven't been able to effectively defend Linux against this onslaught. I mean, how can I when the guy has no problem lying if it will prevent him from having to learn something non-Windows? It's his word against mine, and he can find FUD to back up his side to counter any pro-Linux research I might do. (He's more experienced than I am, and even though I've been at the company longer he's considered senior.)
So, people shouldn't think that Linux is winning the war of the office. Maybe in CA it is, but here in the stix, Bill Gates' tinkertoy-set still reigns supreme.
Any tips on how to fix this situation would be greatly appreciated... though I realize I'll probably get a lot of Windows-head who seem to frequent Slashdot now telling me I should go with the flow....
utter misunderstanding of economics (Score:2)
>Capitalism is based on the assumption of limited
>resources and unlimited demand (driven by
>necessity or greed).
No. But this is vaguely a description of the notion of scarcity. *All* economic systems attempt to deal with this, including marx. Furthermore, "limited resources" does not mean "fixed quantity of resources," and unlimited demand has nothing to do with market economics or capitalist thought. The problem is that the quantity available at a price of zero exceeds the quanity demanded at that price.
>In this scenario, the only way to increase your
>pie share is at the expense of your >competitor(s).
This is *not* market or capitalist thinking. Facscist, perhaps.
As a matter of fact, this contradicts the very *reason* that theses systems are argued superior: that they are the most efficient at increasing the size of the pie. You *can* gain at the same time as your competitor; market economics *can* be a positive sum game (though this is not guaranteed).
>The theory is that this should lead to a balance
>of players, each struggling against
>each other and providing the consumers with the
>benefits of lower prices/better products
>(Smith+).... the reality is that situation is
>easily made unstabland results in monopoly
>capitalism (Reality).
Reality? It is contradicted by virtually all of the data, at least in the United States. Over the past century, the portion of the economy dominated by monopolized and oligopolized industries has steadily dropped, while those dominated by competitive markets has steadily risen.
hawk, professor of economics
So why are car door handles like night and day. (Score:2)
As for asses in IRC channels, I've noticed most people can't even begin to explain their problems clearly. What I can't understand is where the emotional fits come from. They're both frustrating, confusing, and disturbing to someone trying to help.
Forget rtfm. Linux could use some better manuals. Being uptodate is a red herring since last I heard email is still email just as it was years ago. 2+2 still = 4.
The problem is people don't even read dialogs. I'm sorry but there's a point where people have to grow up. There's no such thing as infinite convenience.
Finally, let's face it. You're talking about 30 years of innovation all at once. you want to teach people 30 years worth of shit? C'mon. It's not enough to just embrace users. They need to learn to go after the things they want. Computers aren't toasters. They're vehicles at best.
Bright spots in the darkness (Score:2)
There was a small linux pavillion in which LinuxMall had a sizable booth. I came to the rescue of one of their salesguys who was mystified by the package on one of his own shelves labled "Yellow Dog Linux".
DVD was a big item this year with everything from jukeboxes to portable vid players being hyped. Another item in the funky neat area was the Pocket PC, whose main unit with the combo CD/floppy undocked was about the size of those old neon plastic nine-volt radios of the '70s. It's a mini Pentium running Windows but the booth exihibitors are pretty hot on Linux as apparantly they've made a licensing deal with Corel to get $300 ready-to run desktop kits.
No Mac action per se, but here and there the odd G4 with Cinema display for video demo and the scattering of imacs. The bulk of those network drives like Snap! have finally discovered the world beyond Windows. They've added support for both Linux and Appleshare/Appleshare over IP.
It was a relatively tonedowned show compared to PC/Expos of late but busy nonetheless.
Re:And this is an issue because?... (Score:3)
Most of the scrolling gadgets in mice don't make any provision for scrolling sideways. I have seen one mouse that had a little Thinkpad-like 'Trackpoint' device on it for scrolling both up and down and left and right. That might be a little more useful than the wheel gadgets, especially since it would probably be smoother and quiet. I still want a real, reasonably sized middle button though.
Re:And this is an issue because?... (Score:2)
PC Expo Pics (Score:3)
Can't wait for July 18... (Score:4)
Re:Call for the slashdot olympics (Score:2)
and figure out the starting date. Not only damn
funny, but a great waste of karma..
How about 'Best Troll Impersonation', where the
objective it to look exactly like one of the
established trolls. (Eg, an fake Fat-time & Lubie,
a new episode of 'Star Wars') Or perhaps "Most
Believable goatse.cx Link".
Really?! (Score:3)
PDA stuff at the expo (Score:2)
Wish I was there..
wish
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And this is an issue because?... (Score:4)
If Microsoft suddenly showed up at an Open Source convention and said "Here's Office 2001 with source code for *NIX", yeah, then I would be surprised. But as it stands Microsoft has the same monopoly share at the expos as it does with OS's in general: all of it.
Besides, I'm not a big detractor of MS at shows anyway. They give some pretty awesome prizes for 15 minutes of their time. I watched from afar while Sun was doing their Java presentation at one show, and the Microsoft presenter asked "OK, here's a quiz, where should you go for up-to-date travel information?" "Expedia," I answered. Bam. Free Microsoft Intellimouse Explorer and Natural Keyboard Pro.
Not bad for pandering to a major corporation for 30 seconds (and I can go right back to Linux and FreeBSD).
Re:Marketing Dollars (Score:2)
Also that Linux seems to making a strong showing there, even if it is off in a corner. The idea that RedHat gave out 400 CD in one day, mostly to suites is very encouraging, IMHO.
Having a big marketing budget can always help a product, but if they don't deliver eventually no matter how big you marketing budget is it won't help.
Re:Hot Grits? (Score:2)
ROB ,will you PLEASE fix my account so I can start posting at 1 again instead of 2?! I want my goddamn PREVIEW feature back...
Sigh. Stupid consumer, overzealous CEOs.... (Score:4)
1) E-commerce makes a lot of money. So does catalog sales (JCPenny, Sears, etc...). E-commerce is really just the simple progression of mail order sales onto digital media and communication channels.
2) Wireless data delivery, as in getting stocks and scores over you mobile phone, really isn't that big of a deal. Simple evolution of pager and mobile phone technologies, nothing more.
3) Handheld computing is just evoliving, nothing really amazing about it. Simple evolution of the calculator, in my opinion.
4) The marketing industry has simply blown it's top. Everything "E" is the current focus, and advertisers and media execs are singing all the way to the bank. They have taken simple product evolution in the consumer electronics industry, which can be related to the "revolution" of adding the freshness date to the bottom of beer cans, and made these "marvelous" to be much more larger than life than they really are.
Quite simply, the wizzards of oz are really putting on quite a show.
Maybe, one day, the media zombies of the world will start seeing through these inflated advances in technology and realize the actual, unrealized potential of technology and convince these buisnesses to bring _real_ revolution to the table. Or, at least bring the inflated costs of these products and services down.
(Note, this post was just an observation, no real point to it
Re:Funny MSNBC coverage (Score:2)
Damn, that was a real waste, then. Here I could have been seeing purple-fringed dragons circling Venus to the tune of Pink Floyd's _Echoes_, and instead my hallucination is a lame PC Expo piece with an error-spewing palmtop...
Speaking of Linux in mainstream places (Score:2)
Re:Welcome to the really real world. (Score:2)
I *have* been able to find good help with USENET; I've found people to be very friendly. You should also try searching deja.com first to see if someone has already answered your question. Hope that helps. Just remember that there are a lot of losers out there who get their kicks by being nasty.
Re:slashdot going "down hill" (Score:2)
The war analogy is only accurate if you're trying to win. If you want Linux to be the dominant operating system, then yes, you have a war to fight. That's not what I want. I want to knock Microsoft off its high horse, and I want Linux to be used where it's appropriate to be used, and I want Linux to improve so that it will be more useful to more people, but why should it dominate? Remember that Linus Torvalds himself said that he doesn't want Linux to control 90% of the market, because then Linux would start to suck almost as bad as Windows.
A much better goal to strive for is interoperability. Make it so that if I use platform A and you use platform B, we can still communicate and share documents and ideas and such, and our choice of platform doesn't matter. This is where Microsoft has a stranglehold. If you regularly exchange Office documents and your corporate intranet uses Exchange, you're pretty much stuck with Windows (there are other apps that can read Office documents but none of them are good enough to be acceptible alternatives in a Windows-centric environment where many documents are exchanged).
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PC Expo may run Linux backend, Windows frontend (Score:2)
When he submitted the form, it blew up and I
noticed the little "Apache" tag at the bottom.
I asked the guy who was assisting people with registration if they ran Linux for their backend and he said he didn't know.
Fialar
Rise and fall of empires (Score:4)
Welcome to the really real world. (Score:2)